I don't remember acting like that

Discussion in 'Substitute Teachers' started by Mr Magoo, Jan 18, 2017.

  1. Mr Magoo

    Mr Magoo Comrade

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    Jan 18, 2017

    I know we could get loud and act up.

    But, man !

    I sent two students to the office today.

    I could go over everything bad that they did. The worst part was, they would not stop doing
    those things , even when warned repeatedly.

    I took a step back and looked at the class. The other students in the class did not deserve to be in a classroom with the disruption those two students were bringing.

    It was even starting to spread to other students by their bad example.

    A good question is, why do some Teachers allow that ? It seemed like (At least to me) that those two students did not suddenly start acting that bad only because there was a Sub there.

    The other 28 people in the class don't deserve to have to put up with that.

    I as a Sub, don't deserve to have to put up with that.

    What was so bad?

    Ok

    First one student was 30 minutes late the first period of the day. That student was in the same room (Slightly different subject) latter on in the day.

    That student was 15 minutes late (The different period).

    The two students were buddies. Talking loud. Trash talk about their adventure getting in a strip club at the age of 16. In graphic detail in front of female students, loudly.

    I warned them several times.

    At the same time they were doing that, they were doing no work. Using Cellphones (Again warned repentantly not to use them)

    One of the students put a hat on , which they should not have done and started making a paper airplane.

    All the while , every few words they would cuss.

    Finally I sent them both to the office.

    They came back in 10 minutes, saying the office sent them back (Without a office pass) so I sent them right back to the office to get a pass - they never came back.

    I suppose it could be they only act like that when Subs show up.

    I will not ignore behavior like that. I think that is why so many go down the bad path. It's to much trouble
    to say no, you don't do that. Then they decide to do a little worse, then more, then more.

    I will say I have only been a Sub a few years, and those Teachers that let the students act up, I don't see them Teaching any more. The ones who were stricter, they (those Teachers are still here).
    (Maybe it's just my impression, it seems that way)
     
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  3. Secondary Teach

    Secondary Teach Companion

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    Jan 18, 2017

    You should consider substitute teaching in different school environments or grade levels, if you can. I do notice that you complain rather frequently about student misbehavior. Why not try changing it up, alittle? Or, maybe accept less of the opportunities that will cause stress to yourself. Also, schools will may add you to their blocked list if they can determine you cannot control the class. Sending them to the office every time misbehavior happens is unacceptable- even for a substitute teacher.
    :)
     
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  4. Leaborb192

    Leaborb192 Devotee

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    Jan 19, 2017

    Depends. There's such a sub shortage in certain areas that they're just happy to have people. A colleague and I watched a sub get in a 2nd grader's face in the hallway, and screamed at her, we told the principal who said she didn't want her in the building again. Guess what? She was.
     
  5. Mr Magoo

    Mr Magoo Comrade

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    Jan 19, 2017

    Over at the Jr Highs Teachers do that all the time. They don't scream though, they do talk loud. (I don't do Jr Highs)
     
  6. Mr Magoo

    Mr Magoo Comrade

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    Jan 19, 2017

    Next time I do that class, the class will act quiet and act very good.

    Those two students that I sent to the office, in future classes they will not act like they did.

    Of course there is the one time when a normally out of control student saw me standing by the classroom door and turned and skipped the class. (I marked that student absent) Several other students saw that and on the way in the door said Thank You.
     
  7. ms.irene

    ms.irene Devotee

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    Jan 19, 2017

    I wonder if part of the problem was that you let it go too far. Talking about sexually explicit behavior is a form of harassment. I would cut that off right away and if they persisted, kick them out. No one needs to be hearing that, but by warning them "several times," you may have implied that it was permissible.
     
  8. Linguist92021

    Linguist92021 Phenom

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    Jan 19, 2017

    Maybe it was you :) Don't be so quick to blame the teacher, and say there if there is bad behavior, it's because they allow it. Maybe it's because they see a sub, and act up and you allowed it.

    And yes, you do complain a lot about every day issues, frankly I'm surprised that you're so surprised about student behavior. But maybe stop complaining, and do something about it.
     
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  9. Mr Magoo

    Mr Magoo Comrade

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    Jan 20, 2017

    One thing I have been thinking about with classroom management.

    Is when the students act like out of control Jr High students is treat them like Jr High Teachers treat them

    I remember when I would Sub Jr High
    (I no longer Sub Jr High)

    Those Jr High Teachers are tough.

    I was doing a English class in Jr High, having the students read a page in a paperback book. (The very same paperback book that I read in Jr High)

    The students started acting like they did not know how to read.

    A Teachers Aide came in the class room and saw that and went and got the school Police Officer to sit in the back of the classroom the rest of the day.

    It was wonderful ,a miracle just happened all the students could read !

    I was freaked out myself.

    That is just one of the things I remember when doing Jr High.

    I will think about the classroom management of Jr High Teachers and use it when I have a rough High School class.
     
  10. Teachertimes

    Teachertimes Rookie

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    Jan 20, 2017

    Uhh your posts always make me nervous to leave my class with a substitute. I was a substitute, it's a tough job. Maybe take a step back.
     
  11. Mr Magoo

    Mr Magoo Comrade

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    Jan 20, 2017

    Today was a good day :)

    Yesterday , I thought about sending 8 students to the office during the same period.

    I decided that the office would not like that, no matter how disruptive those students were.

    So , I did the best I could. I separated them as far from each other as I could.

    That did bring the room volume down 10 or 15 percent.

    I decided before I told them to move, that if they refused to move I would send for the Principal. And after the lecture the class would get, I would point out each of those 8 students and ask the Principal to take them out.

    It is a good thing that they agreed to move.

    Today was much better.

    P.S.
    That wild class (With the 8) another Sub had just done it for two days and then canceled the last day to do it. (I wonder why ? )
    Then I picked it up.

    I did not know that when I got it.
     
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  12. GemStone

    GemStone Cohort

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    Jan 21, 2017

    Cut out the warnings. They should not be getting multiple chances. Follow the school's discipline procedures so that you have a reasonable plan in place to follow.
     
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  13. Secondary Teach

    Secondary Teach Companion

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    Jan 22, 2017

    Good to see another method has worked for you! You can also request some discipline strategies from the teacher you're subbing for, or a neighboring teacher at the school. It sounds as if you've been subbing for a while, so I'm sure many of the teachers you know would be able to share of their strategies with you. Your above method, separating/relocating students is an effective one.
    :)
     
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  14. Linguist92021

    Linguist92021 Phenom

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    Jan 22, 2017

    You keep giving your power away and that's why the kids don't respect you. The office, the principal, the school police officer, all the places you refer them to or ask help from, you keep giving your power to them. You show the kids that you can't handle them, and they know you need help.
    You need to have a firm and consistent system in place that you stick to. Lay down your expectations in the beginning of the class. Do not write them on the board, that's pointless. Not too many warnings. If you have problems with 8 kids, send ONE out and write them up and usually that sends the message that you mean business and the rest will shape up.

    Other than that I don't know what to say. Your posts still sound like you're a 14 year old kid, or probably a troll just having fun with your absurd scenarios. No sub I have ever met have been this clueless, and trust me, I've met some weird ones.
     
  15. Mr Magoo

    Mr Magoo Comrade

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    Jan 23, 2017

    When Teachers do the class the students act differently.

    I was Subbing a class last year, when I walked in the class the Teacher was in the classroom. The Teacher told me that she was doing the class with me.

    So, anyway the Teacher was standing in the classroom, I was standing just outside the class by the door during the passing period. (As the school handbook says that I should do)

    As the students came in the class they started hollering * It's a Sub we can go crazy !

    The Teacher standing just inside the door, she looked shocked at her students as they came inside the room. After they saw her they calmed down.
     
  16. Peregrin5

    Peregrin5 Maven

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    Jan 23, 2017

    Agreed that writing on the board is pretty pointless. But I do have to say that I could see how it's hard for subs to have a firm and consistent system in place, especially since it's hard to build consistency when you only see them for one day. I always inform my subs that I don't expect them to take on discipline other than admin support calls or referrals. Instead I want them to leave me detailed notes about what happened in the classroom along with specific names, and I will enforce consequences on students.
     
  17. Pashtun

    Pashtun Fanatic

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    Jan 23, 2017

    I am curious because I kow how thoughtful you are, why would you not want them to continue with you classroom management plan, at least the initial consequences? Especially in January when one would expect the students to know the system, expectations, and consequences?
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2017
  18. Linguist92021

    Linguist92021 Phenom

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    Jan 23, 2017

    That's true. But a daily sub can still have his own system in place. I'm sure you have seen subs who usually do a good job, and others who are struggling, or have good days / bad days. Kids learn what they can get away with quickly, and that goes for subs as well. Subs will have a reputation.
     
  19. Peregrin5

    Peregrin5 Maven

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    I mostly wouldn't expect a sub to do it because they themselves would have to learn the very particular way in which I conduct my classroom management, and that's probably too much effort for most subs to put in for just one day of teaching in my classroom, and so I expect most subs wouldn't even bother to do it even if I asked them to. Because I can't be sure that a sub would do it or do it in the right way, I'd rather just not ask them to do it period. But this is for a secondary classroom where they would only see the kid for an hour or so. There's usually a limit to how much a kid can get up to in that amount of time anyway. In an elementary classroom I could see why a teacher would want the sub to follow their management plan because they would see the kid for longer.
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2017
  20. Pashtun

    Pashtun Fanatic

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    Jan 23, 2017

    You have me curious as to how complex your system is, that it would not be fairly easy to understand, even for a sub.
     
  21. Peregrin5

    Peregrin5 Maven

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    Jan 23, 2017

    Well it's not complex in terms of steps. It's more complex in the nuances. Like when giving consequences, give them impassively without yelling, scolding, or threatening. Be matter-of-fact. If a student argues, do not engage, walk away and let them take accountability for enacting the consequence on their own. If they fail to do that, enact the next consequence. Depending on the behavior, you might just straight to time-out, or have them stay after class, or at lunch, or call home, but not all three. It depends on what is logical at the time.

    My general CM plan is warning-independent study-stay after class (from there any of the previous mentioned possibilities). But again, there are a lot of little things that if done incorrectly could throw a wrench into the classroom environment I've built. It's just easier to tell the sub to document everything and tell students that they're expected to follow the same behavioral expectations while I'm away, and I will enact the same (or worse, usually worse) consequences when I return for any behavior that I missed.
     

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